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Saturday 26th August 2017, KO 17:30 BST.
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redmaria
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Sun Jan 08, 2017 7:57 pm

Do you wake up every mornig in cold sweat screaming '' shirt sellers , shirt sellers... '' ?

you really are obsessed with it

knackered old shirt sellers don't score 50 goals in 45 games
I presume that your comment means you can't find an honest sensible answer to my question so ridicule is the best way forward



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joze ruis
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:26 pm

latest RAshford comments on Zlatan

''For the young players to see his character and the way he approaches every game is invaluable.Some players can't bring that when they move clubs.We have to try to learn from him while he is here and take what we can from his game.
Zlatan and Rooney are the two that stand out.
I grew up watching Rooney play week in, week out at Old Trafford, so those are the two that you look at and try to emulate."

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redmaria
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Wed Jan 18, 2017 8:01 am

latest RAshford comments on Zlatan

''For the young players to see his character and the way he approaches every game is invaluable.Some players can't bring that when they move clubs.We have to try to learn from him while he is here and take what we can from his game.
Zlatan and Rooney are the two that stand out.
I grew up watching Rooney play week in, week out at Old Trafford, so those are the two that you look at and try to emulate."
That could be an honest comment.Equally it could be the correct but political thing to say
Even if he hated him he couldn't say so as that would be the end of his chances
I know plenty of players from the 1960's that openly say one thing and privately say another about team mates
You have to remember these are not mates playing with each other but professional footballers

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joze ruis
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Wed Jan 18, 2017 9:44 am

i agree , it could mean nothing.

But the players do seem to click. Watching their body language , their joking during interviews , things they post on the internet.

Zlatan and Pogba seem close with all the constant banter between them.

Spanish contingent look a high school clique. They post pictures and compliments on internet on each other all the time.

However in any squad in any team there are people who don't like each other, there's no way around it....

Ronaldo said he wasn't speaking to Giggs , Scholes and Rio off the pitch

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:02 am

i agree , it could mean nothing.

But the players do seem to click. Watching their body language , their joking during interviews , things they post on the internet.

Zlatan and Pogba seem close with all the constant banter between them.

Spanish contingent look a high school clique. They post pictures and compliments on internet on each other all the time.

However in any squad in any team there are people who don't like each other, there's no way around it....

Ronaldo said he wasn't speaking to Giggs , Scholes and Rio off the pitch
huh? i swear ronaldo and rio were good mates.
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Watch your words; they become actions.
Watch your actions; they become habits.
Watch your habits; they become character.
Watch your character; it becomes your destiny!


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joze ruis
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:44 am

he said it himself

“When I was at Manchester United, winning the Champions League, with some players such as Giggs, Ferdinand and Scholes, our discussions were limited to ‘Good morning’ and ‘Good night’. But when we were on the pitch together, there was total understanding. I don’t need to go out for dinner with Benzema or Bale. What counts is what happens on the pitch.”

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:55 pm

Just a bit of info for anyone thinking Zlatan is only here to sell shirts and provides nothing else.

I have tallied up the points Zlatan's goals have earned us in the league, so 2 points for games where his goals made us win and 1 point for goals which made us tie;

wins - Bournemouth, Southampton, Crystal Palace, West Brom and Sunderland are games where his goals made the difference for winning vs ties, 5 games times 2 points is 10 points

ties - West Ham, Everton, and Liverpool. 3 games at 1 point equals 3 points

So that is 13 points in the league earned by Zlatan's goals. Without them we would be in 9th place with 27 points, that's 17 points off of 4th place, 25 points of 1st place.
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Re: RE: Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Thu Jan 19, 2017 2:30 am

Just a bit of info for anyone thinking Zlatan is only here to sell shirts and provides nothing else.

I have tallied up the points Zlatan's goals have earned us in the league, so 2 points for games where his goals made us win and 1 point for goals which made us tie;

wins - Bournemouth, Southampton, Crystal Palace, West Brom and Sunderland are games where his goals made the difference for winning vs ties, 5 games times 2 points is 10 points

ties - West Ham, Everton, and Liverpool. 3 games at 1 point equals 3 points

So that is 13 points in the league earned by Zlatan's goals. Without them we would be in 9th place with 27 points, that's 17 points off of 4th place, 25 points of 1st place.
Those are not scored against Barcelona, it doesn't count
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Thu Jan 19, 2017 1:41 pm

Just a bit of info for anyone thinking Zlatan is only here to sell shirts and provides nothing else.

I have tallied up the points Zlatan's goals have earned us in the league, so 2 points for games where his goals made us win and 1 point for goals which made us tie;

wins - Bournemouth, Southampton, Crystal Palace, West Brom and Sunderland are games where his goals made the difference for winning vs ties, 5 games times 2 points is 10 points

ties - West Ham, Everton, and Liverpool. 3 games at 1 point equals 3 points

So that is 13 points in the league earned by Zlatan's goals. Without them we would be in 9th place with 27 points, that's 17 points off of 4th place, 25 points of 1st place.
It's unfair to use Facts and Logic and Reasoning against someone who doesn't want to listen.
I can't believe it. I can't believe it. Football. Bloody hell.

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Thu Jan 19, 2017 5:36 pm

Just a bit of info for anyone thinking Zlatan is only here to sell shirts and provides nothing else.

I have tallied up the points Zlatan's goals have earned us in the league, so 2 points for games where his goals made us win and 1 point for goals which made us tie;

wins - Bournemouth, Southampton, Crystal Palace, West Brom and Sunderland are games where his goals made the difference for winning vs ties, 5 games times 2 points is 10 points

ties - West Ham, Everton, and Liverpool. 3 games at 1 point equals 3 points

So that is 13 points in the league earned by Zlatan's goals. Without them we would be in 9th place with 27 points, that's 17 points off of 4th place, 25 points of 1st place.
Again with the stats thing
It's like your avantar Donald.He has stats to show he won the election by getting most votes off the citizens.
i am making a presumption but i hope you accept that Hilary Clinton got more people to vote for her,and she is not even liked
The Donald(i do love that stupid name!!) got more strategic votes and that is why he is in
So it just goes to show what you can do with stats

Now that you've woken up Coach Marcus i might as well play a little
You have gone into ALL the goals that Zlatan has scored and made a presumption,to back your stats that nobody would have scored these goals if the shirt seller hadn't.
I think i will take issue with that and suggest that possibly Martial or Rashford might have scored just as many
Then lets go sideways to
Liverpool(away)-Finished 0-0 and Zlatan missed an important header **2 points lost
Burnley(home) -0-0 and Zlatan missed several good chances including a very important one near the end that would have won the game **2 points lost
Chelsea(away)-1-0 down and Zlatan misses a relatively easy chance that might have turned the game-3 points lost
Now add those 7 points to us and take one away from Liverpool and 3 away from Chelsea and we are second and just 2 points off top spot
Now the above is just off my memory as i have neither the time nor the inclination to watch every game on a dodgy,probably illegal, computer feed like many of you guys do.
If i have missed anything then we are closing in on the championship according to stats
Unfortunately the only stats that matter to the fans is that we are still SIXTH which is not that much better than your daft way of getting us to NINTH

The only stats that matter to the club is how many Zlatan shirts have we sold which the answer is "loads"

So you be happy with Zlatan,the club megastore is happy with Zlatan.
coach Marcus managed to get a pop at me and somebody who has been in the desert sun for too long gets a pop at me and sounds happy

As for me i am happy as well
I drove past the ground today and there are two banners from the top of the stadium to the floor telling the tourists and pilgrims to take an Uber taxi to wherever you watch the game
So off you go.I personally will be driving my own car to Stoke.For those on the other side of the world that's an hour south
:party: :party:

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Thu Jan 19, 2017 9:33 pm

Again with the stats thing
By all means let’s totally disregard statistics because they do not help your argument. I guess that the league managers will drop their analysis department and just call RedMaria to determine how their players are doing.

It's like your avantar Donald.He has stats to show he won the election by getting most votes off the citizens.
i am making a presumption but i hope you accept that Hilary Clinton got more people to vote for her,and she is not even liked
The Donald(i do love that stupid name!!) got more strategic votes and that is why he is in

This response makes less sense than a Trump 3:00 am tweet. While I totally disagree with using the Electoral College over the popular vote; that was the rules going into the election. It’s like Wenger complaining that Arsenal played much better football and they should get the point because their opponent play defensively and scored a lucky goal.

So it just goes to show what you can do with stats

Now that you've woken up Coach Marcus i might as well play a little
You have gone into ALL the goals that Zlatan has scored and made a presumption,to back your stats that nobody would have scored these goals if the shirt seller hadn't.
I think i will take issue with that and suggest that possibly Martial or Rashford might have scored just as many

You can speculate all day long that someone else might have scored the goals the simple reality is that no one on the pitch in those games scored. Zlatan has scored 14 goals in the premier league so far this season but that doesn’t comply with your reality so I guess we will just drop that one. I have to wonder what pet derogatory name you had picked out for Martial when he started the season playing like a buffer?

Then lets go sideways to
Liverpool(away)-Finished 0-0 and Zlatan missed an important header **2 points lost
Burnley(home) -0-0 and Zlatan missed several good chances including a very important one near the end that would have won the game **2 points lost
Chelsea(away)-1-0 down and Zlatan misses a relatively easy chance that might have turned the game-3 points lost
Now add those 7 points to us and take one away from Liverpool and 3 away from Chelsea and we are second and just 2 points off top spot

Now the above is just off my memory as i have neither the time nor the inclination to watch every game on a dodgy,probably illegal, computer feed like many of you guys do.

Not all of us can cadge ticket that allows us to watch games with the “prawn sandwich” brigade; some of us actually pay hard earned cash for the internet and television feeds that let us watch the games.

If i have missed anything then we are closing in on the championship according to stats


Unfortunately the only stats that matter to the fans is that we are still SIXTH which is not that much better than your daft way of getting us to NINTH

Is it just more of your speculation or do you have any hard facts or statistics (there’s that word again) for shirt sale by player? Do you have comparable shirt sale by player for other clubs or are United the only team that sell shirts? It is unrealistic to think that the club would only be concerned with shirt sales; common sense says that success on the pitch makes United a more marketable to sponsors and that’s where the money is. Check the annual reports if you have any questions about revenue generation.
The only stats that matter to the club is how many Zlatan shirts have we sold which the answer is "loads"

So you be happy with Zlatan,the club megastore is happy with Zlatan.
coach Marcus managed to get a pop at me and somebody who has been in the desert sun for too long gets a pop at me and sounds happy

As for me i am happy as well

To add to your limited knowledge of America and specifically Arizona, it is snowing as I write this resonse. There are many eco-systems in Arizona.

I am extremely pleased that you are “happy”; it is difficult to tell from your postings.


I drove past the ground today and there are two banners from the top of the stadium to the floor telling the tourists and pilgrims to take an Uber taxi to wherever you watch the game
So off you go.I personally will be driving my own car to Stoke.For those on the other side of the world that's an hour south
I can't believe it. I can't believe it. Football. Bloody hell.

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:19 pm

Again with the stats thing
By all means let’s totally disregard statistics because they do not help your argument. I guess that the league managers will drop their analysis department and just call RedMaria to determine how their players are doing.

It's like your avantar Donald.He has stats to show he won the election by getting most votes off the citizens.
i am making a presumption but i hope you accept that Hilary Clinton got more people to vote for her,and she is not even liked
The Donald(i do love that stupid name!!) got more strategic votes and that is why he is in

This response makes less sense than a Trump 3:00 am tweet. While I totally disagree with using the Electoral College over the popular vote; that was the rules going into the election. It’s like Wenger complaining that Arsenal played much better football and they should get the point because their opponent play defensively and scored a lucky goal.

So it just goes to show what you can do with stats

Now that you've woken up Coach Marcus i might as well play a little
You have gone into ALL the goals that Zlatan has scored and made a presumption,to back your stats that nobody would have scored these goals if the shirt seller hadn't.
I think i will take issue with that and suggest that possibly Martial or Rashford might have scored just as many

You can speculate all day long that someone else might have scored the goals the simple reality is that no one on the pitch in those games scored. Zlatan has scored 14 goals in the premier league so far this season but that doesn’t comply with your reality so I guess we will just

drop that one. I have to wonder what pet derogatory name you had picked out for Martial when he started the season playing like a buffer?


WHO ELSE COULD HAVE SCORED.ZLATAN PLAYED UP FRONT BY HIMSELF

Then lets go sideways to
Liverpool(away)-Finished 0-0 and Zlatan missed an important header **2 points lost
Burnley(home) -0-0 and Zlatan missed several good chances including a very important one near the end that would have won the game **2 points lost
Chelsea(away)-1-0 down and Zlatan misses a relatively easy chance that might have turned the game-3 points lost
Now add those 7 points to us and take one away from Liverpool and 3 away from Chelsea and we are second and just 2 points off top spot

Now the above is just off my memory as i have neither the time nor the inclination to watch every game on a dodgy,probably illegal, computer feed like many of you guys do.

Not all of us can cadge ticket that allows us to watch games with the “prawn sandwich” brigade; some of us actually pay hard earned cash for the internet and television feeds that let us watch the games.

I DON'T CADGE TICKETS.I APPLY FOR THEM IN THE LOYALTY POT
I USUALLY GET REJECTED AS OVER 90% OF THE GAMES WATCHED OVER 40 YEARS DOESN'T MAKE ME A LOYAL FAN APPARENTLY
NOW IF I WAS CHINESE,JAPANESE,SCANDINAVIAN,AUSTRALIAN OR AMERICAN WITH £1500 TO SPEND THAT WOULD MAKE ME A LOYAL FAN
I THINK SITTING AT HOME IN ARIZONA WITH NO INTENTION OF EVER VISITING UNITED OR AT BEST JUST POSSIBLY ONCE ON A PILGIAMAGE NEITEHR PUTS YOU IN A POSITION TO COMMENT ON LOYAL FANS,CADGERS OR PRAWN SANDWICHES

If i have missed anything then we are closing in on the championship according to stats


Unfortunately the only stats that matter to the fans is that we are still SIXTH which is not that much better than your daft way of getting us to NINTH

Is it just more of your speculation or do you have any hard facts or statistics (there’s that word again) for shirt sale by player? Do you have comparable shirt sale by player for other clubs or are United the only team that sell shirts? It is unrealistic to think that the club would only be concerned with shirt sales; common sense says that success on the pitch makes United a more marketable to sponsors and that’s where the money is. Check the annual reports if you have any questions about revenue generation.

THE SHIRT SALES BY UNITED PLAYER IS REGULARLY AVAILABLE AND IS ON THE INTERNET.I HAVE NO INTEREST IN OTHER CLUBS
WITHOUT DIGGING DEEPER HOW DO YOU THINK UNITED ACHIEVE THE TURNOVER THEY DO?
POSSIBLY BY SELLING TICKETS AT £30 EACH.BEHAVE!!
HOW DO YOU THINK THEY ATTRACT SUCH MASSIVE SHIRT SPONSORSHIP DEALS?
IS IT BECAUSE THE MD'S OF THOSE COMPANIES LOVE UNITED?BEHAVE

I CAN'T BE ARSED LOOKING BUT AS YOU HAVE THE TIME PLEASE FEEL FREE TO INVESTIGATE
YOU WILL FIND I AM CORRECT
The only stats that matter to the club is how many Zlatan shirts have we sold which the answer is "loads"

So you be happy with Zlatan,the club megastore is happy with Zlatan.
coach Marcus managed to get a pop at me and somebody who has been in the desert sun for too long gets a pop at me and sounds happy

As for me i am happy as well

To add to your limited knowledge of America and specifically Arizona, it is snowing as I write this resonse. There are many eco-systems in Arizona.

WELL I DON'T KNOW WHY IT IS SNOWING
GLOBAL WARMING IS A LIE.THE DONALD TOLD YOU SO.HE MUST HAVE STATS(THERE'S THAT WORD AGAIN) TO CONFIRM IT SO ARE YOU SURE IT IS SNOWING OR HAVE YOU BEEN ON THE BUD AGAIN?
:laugh: :laugh:

I am extremely pleased that you are “happy”; it is difficult to tell from your postings.


I drove past the ground today and there are two banners from the top of the stadium to the floor telling the tourists and pilgrims to take an Uber taxi to wherever you watch the game
So off you go.I personally will be driving my own car to Stoke.For those on the other side of the world that's an hour south

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joze ruis
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Fri Jan 20, 2017 9:01 am

So if he doesnt come to OT he's not a loyal fan, if he does come to OT then he's a pilgrim , a memebr of an ipad branch.....

If there were no worldwide fan base United couldn't compete on a transfer market and you would complain about that, now that there is you of course complain about ''pilgrims''....

if United didnt sign senior striker you would complain about that, now that it did and he's a top scorer of the league you're complaining he's taking away minutes from Rahsford and Martial and is a shirt seller.....

You're complaining about this new '' galacticos '' model where super stars are paying for themsleves with their commercial value. The alternative of this new model was not buyig anyone and saving money and you were again complaining....



What the fornicate do you want Ray ?

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redmaria
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Fri Jan 20, 2017 10:42 am

So if he doesnt come to OT he's not a loyal fan, if he does come to OT then he's a pilgrim , a memebr of an ipad branch.....

If there were no worldwide fan base United couldn't compete on a transfer market and you would complain about that, now that there is you of course complain about ''pilgrims''....

if United didnt sign senior striker you would complain about that, now that it did and he's a top scorer of the league you're complaining he's taking away minutes from Rahsford and Martial and is a shirt seller.....

You're complaining about this new '' galacticos '' model where super stars are paying for themsleves with their commercial value. The alternative of this new model was not buyig anyone and saving money and you were again complaining....



What the fornicate do you want Ray ?
You couldn't be further from the truth
The grouches i have are all about priorities,obligations and the like
The other grouch i have is about strong opinions and daft reasoning

So let's pick through your points one by one and hopefully you will see where i am coming from

1 "if he doesn't come to Old Trafford he's not a loyal United fan,if he does come he's a pilgrim ot a member of the ipad branch
If here were no worldwide fan base United couldn't compete in the transfer market etc

Well my opinion is as follows
You can be a fan of whatever club you like.Travelling to a ground to watch your team depends on time,finance,ticketing opportunity and many other reasons
Many of the so called,loyal fans from the Far east and Middle East have often supported "other clubs" even the enemy(in United's case that's Liverpool or City) up until a season or two ago
It would not be unusual for them to switch allegiance next season if City or Liverpool won say the European Cup
Very often they will support a player as opposed to a club and their allegiance switches when that player leaves the club
Where did the Japanese go when Kagawa went back to Germany?
How many Chinse will vanish when Wazza goes?
Why did Fulham have so many Far eastern fans when Inomoto was playing for them but now you can't find one at The Cottage
Since City were taken over by Mansour a matchday is just a long line of chauffeur driven Mercedes full of middle eastern fans
I never saw any when City were in the lower divisions
Prices at City are so high that no local fans can afford them
Turning back to United i was part of Docs Red Army when we went down into division two in 74/75
Every ground was sold out every game and not a tourist in sight
Phenomenal support at every game.It is in your blood

Funnily enough we managed to attract a few half decent players pre tourist and pilgrim
They included some average players like Denis Law and Pat Crerand who both cost a lot of money
We developed a home grown policy that included some other average players like Duncan Edwards,Bobby Charlton,George Best
So you see you really don't need tourists to build a football club
Just to explain one further grouch
I don't see the benefit of taking a kings ransom or two off a combined tourist and pilgrim army and then making the money vanish to The Caymans
Then buy a player on HP over 4 years(which is what United do)
So if we didn't have a pilgrim/tourist army of supporters then we wouldn't have the Glazers for long because that is who gets their money.Not the club
If you think i am wrong look at other greedy foreign owners at say Hull or Portsmouth

More points on the tourists and pilgrim support
Why does/should £1500 get you a guaranteed ticket for all the big games when fans that have paid out for 40 years plus are told to get lost
My personal grouch on the ipad branch is the way they hold up recording devices high over their heads for ninety minutes
You can't see the bloody game if they are taking a whole row or two in front of you
How would you feel if you went to the cinema and the two rows in front of you were all recording the film with an ipad above their heads
My final grouch is that many of these so called fans(not tourists or pilgrims) but fans who can't make the games,as you mentioned in your post have massive opinions on the club,the way it is run,the coaching,the manager,the tactics,the history etc but proudly announce they never intend to go to watch United play nor give the club a penny(you know who i mean)
Never seen a quality match,never seen the pace of a top class game close up,never seen a player with horrible black,blue and purple legs fight through a pain barrier(well that doesn't happen on gamestation) but still consider themselves the font of all things football

So what do i want
I want the Glazers to sell to a football man who will put the club first
I want a club that will build a team on quality players for the long term future and not a shirt seller for a season
I want a club that will give priority to loyal fans,with or without a big bank account
But that won't happen

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Fri Jan 20, 2017 1:25 pm

Great post,Ray which so many of fans from our generation or of long standing with relate to.
Summed up perfectly in the last paragraph.
:clap: :clap:
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Fri Jan 20, 2017 1:50 pm

Does Paddy know you think he was average?! :laugh:

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joze ruis
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Fri Jan 20, 2017 2:18 pm

@ ray

Let's be realistic here

You could build a top team in the past without global fan base but you can't do it in the present. There isnt one top club that doesn't spend a lot of money on players...not one and you know it...
So no global fans base mean no money , no top players , no success.... it isnt 1968 anymore

So if you don't like '' galactico '' model what is your realistic solution ? and dont say get rid of the owners because we all hate them and still know this wont happen. They will take money out of the club no matter what, at least with this new strategy we fans have a chance of watching the best players here. Jose is getting things togheter and we are on the right track.

And your personal vendetta against Zlatan is ridiculous. The man just came to PL and is a top scorer , how many players could do that ? Your attention is on selling shirts ( which he obviously does ) , mine is on the goals he scores , the exciting moves he makes , his winning mentality that is badly needed after a few shit years....

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Fri Jan 20, 2017 3:43 pm

@ ray

Let's be realistic here

You could build a top team in the past without global fan base but you can't do it in the present. There isnt one top club that doesn't spend a lot of money on players...not one and you know it...
So no global fans base mean no money , no top players , no success.... it isnt 1968 anymore

So if you don't like '' galactico '' model what is your realistic solution ? and dont say get rid of the owners because we all hate them and still know this wont happen. They will take money out of the club no matter what, at least with this new strategy we fans have a chance of watching the best players here. Jose is getting things togheter and we are on the right track.

And your personal vendetta against Zlatan is ridiculous. The man just came to PL and is a top scorer , how many players could do that ? Your attention is on selling shirts ( which he obviously does ) , mine is on the goals he scores , the exciting moves he makes , his winning mentality that is badly needed after a few shit years....
why are you wasting your time? Ray doesn't make the rules on how to follow Manchester United, in fact there are no rules. You will never change his mind, which doesn't matter at all, because it doesn't mean anything, he is just a grouchy old man who wants things to be the way they were 50 years ago, which will never happen, it's a massively different world.
"Make America Great Again!"

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:32 pm

@ ray

Let's be realistic here

You could build a top team in the past without global fan base but you can't do it in the present. There isnt one top club that doesn't spend a lot of money on players...not one and you know it...
So no global fans base mean no money , no top players , no success.... it isnt 1968 anymore

So if you don't like '' galactico '' model what is your realistic solution ? and dont say get rid of the owners because we all hate them and still know this wont happen. They will take money out of the club no matter what, at least with this new strategy we fans have a chance of watching the best players here. Jose is getting things togheter and we are on the right track.

And your personal vendetta against Zlatan is ridiculous. The man just came to PL and is a top scorer , how many players could do that ? Your attention is on selling shirts ( which he obviously does ) , mine is on the goals he scores , the exciting moves he makes , his winning mentality that is badly needed after a few shit years....
why are you wasting your time? Ray doesn't make the rules on how to follow Manchester United, in fact there are no rules. You will never change his mind, which doesn't matter at all, because it doesn't mean anything, he is just a grouchy old man who wants things to be the way they were 50 years ago, which will never happen, it's a massively different world.
Being called a stubborn grouchy old man who won't change his mind is the nearest thing to a compliment from you,Ben
I thought it would be impossible to beat your attitude but it looks like i might have.
There is and has been nobody more like a dog with a bone for the last few years and to be fair you have NEVEr changed your attitude
Yes Wazza is in decline.Nobody denies that but he is still one of our legends based on both stats,which a lot of you thrive on and deeds.
What are you going to do when Wazza is cashed in and Fellaini is still about in two seasons(well they just extended his contract so Jose must be right eh!!)
Will you just assume that this team will become world class again because i assure you it won't
In the very near future we will need to replace Carrick,Wazza and Zlatan
It will be interesting to see who they buy as both Wazza and Zlatan are both massive income sources
I want to see the future and present combined.The hand over should already have started but it hasn't

So you think times have changed and you can't dominate without an international fan base aka as tourists and pilgrims
Well the Real Madrid and Barcelona model hasn't changed over the last 50 or so years.
They bought the best Di Stefano,Puskas and Gento with the clubs own income from fans plus at Barca you won't a better youth policy in the last 30 years plus.
They develop in their own image.they keep the best.They sell those they don't want and use that money to compete for the best available.
There is nobody in the Barca boardroom making a reported ONE BILLION Pounds vanish
Yes we are the richest club in the world but we are also the most indebted.Why

Look at Germany
They do OK and they don't charge the fans £500 plus VAT for a hamburger and chips
Their fans pay the least of anybody in Europe and as far as i am aware Bayern are still a very good team
I say "i don't know" because we have not been good enough to get a game against them other than in a pre season season friendly in the States where the tickets were astronomical

Look at what happens when the money vanishes to the owners
Look at the Scottish League where all the money has been stolen
Lots of International fans at Celtic and Rangers and two second division quality teams playing in front of full houses
So where is the money?

No the old way would still work if the money was invested in the club and not moved away to look for Donald Trumps tax return

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:34 pm

I’ll try and wind my way through your response and attempt to enlighten you on a your miss-information

You can speculate all day long that someone else might have scored the goals the simple reality is that no one on the pitch in those games scored. Zlatan has scored 14 goals in the premier league so far this season but that doesn’t comply with your reality so I guess we will just drop that one. I have to wonder what pet derogatory name you had picked out for Martial when he started the season playing like a buffer?

WHO ELSE COULD HAVE SCORED.ZLATAN PLAYED UP FRONT BY HIMSELF

This may be a surprise to you but there is no rule preventing anyone from scoring, In fact United have a long history of other position, wingers, midfielders and even defenders, scoring goals. Last season Martial scored 17 goals (11 PL) some from the striker position but also from the wing. Rashford scored 8 goals (5 PL) last season mostly from a forward/striker position, but he has already scored 6 (3 PL) goals this season as a substitute and playing wide. In comparison Zlatan has scored 19 goals (14 PL) in little more than half a season, if you can be bothered do the arithmetic. I know these are those pesky statistics again; you do not like them but the rest of us do not have access to the synaptic connection that bounce around in what sits on your shoulder so statistics will have to do.
Martial and Rashford are young player learning their trade and while they need minutes it cannot be at the expense of not playing Zlatan.


Not all of us can cadge ticket that allows us to watch games with the “prawn sandwich” brigade; some of us actually pay hard earned cash for the internet and television feeds that let us watch the games.

I DON'T CADGE TICKETS.I APPLY FOR THEM IN THE LOYALTY POT
I USUALLY GET REJECTED AS OVER 90% OF THE GAMES WATCHED OVER 40 YEARS DOESN'T MAKE ME A LOYAL FAN APPARENTLY
NOW IF I WAS CHINESE,JAPANESE,SCANDINAVIAN,AUSTRALIAN OR AMERICAN WITH £1500 TO SPEND THAT WOULD MAKE ME A LOYAL FAN
I recall on numerous occasion while you discussing arguing ranting about not supporting the Glazers; that the Glazers didn’t get a penny from you for home games because you got your tickets from friends. I could look it up but why bother, you would just deny it or say you were misquoted or just ignore it. So with the tickets in your “friends” name and you not paying for the tickets how is any loyalty program to know you exist? You appear to have resentment, bordering on hatred, of all overseas fans. Is that because they have helped make United into one of the most powerful clubs in the world in any sport or do you just like to hate?

I THINK SITTING AT HOME IN ARIZONA WITH NO INTENTION OF EVER VISITING UNITED OR AT BEST JUST POSSIBLY ONCE ON A PILGIAMAGE NEITEHR PUTS YOU IN A POSITION TO COMMENT ON LOYAL FANS,CADGERS OR PRAWN SANDWICHES

I went to my first United game in 1964 at Turf Moor, the game ended 0-0 which was OK because my Dad was a Burnley fan. After joining the Royal Navy in 66 while home on leave would get to ever game I could, young seamen did not make a lot of money in those days, and probably don’t today either. Since moving to America in the early 72 between work and vacation I would get back to Europe every 2-3 years and I would make every effort to get to Old Trafford or wherever United where playing. My cousin(s) do not appear to have any problems getting ticket, he is an old Barrow Boy so it doesn’t surprise me he can get tickets. So next time you may want to try and finding out a little about the people you are trying to belittle before stepping on your dick. Everyone on this board regardless of how long they have supported United is entitled to an opinion about loyal fans, cadgers and the prawn sandwich brigade.

Is it just more of your speculation or do you have any hard facts or statistics (there’s that word again) for shirt sale by player? Do you have comparable shirt sale by player for other clubs or are United the only team that sell shirts? It is unrealistic to think that the club would only be concerned with shirt sales; common sense says that success on the pitch makes United a more marketable to sponsors and that’s where the money is. Check the annual reports if you have any questions about revenue generation.

THE SHIRT SALES BY UNITED PLAYER IS REGULARLY AVAILABLE AND IS ON THE INTERNET.I HAVE NO INTEREST IN OTHER CLUBS
WITHOUT DIGGING DEEPER HOW DO YOU THINK UNITED ACHIEVE THE TURNOVER THEY DO?

This appears to be one of your standard replies to any time you are questioned about your speculations; “it’s on the internet – I cannot be bothered looking it up”. Instead you throw out a statement as if it is fact and try and make it sound like a turd in a punch bowl. If you cannot be bothered to substantiate your claims why would I be bothered believing them.
POSSIBLY BY SELLING TICKETS AT £30 EACH.BEHAVE!!
HOW DO YOU THINK THEY ATTRACT SUCH MASSIVE SHIRT SPONSORSHIP DEALS?
IS IT BECAUSE THE MD'S OF THOSE COMPANIES LOVE UNITED?BEHAVE

I CAN'T BE ARSED LOOKING BUT AS YOU HAVE THE TIME PLEASE FEEL FREE TO INVESTIGATE
YOU WILL FIND I AM CORRECT
This is a variation on your standard reply; “I can’t be arsed looking”, a true battle cry for the uninformed. Twice in past discussions I have provided you with the URL for the SEC website where United’s annual reports can be found, you have either forgotten or choose to ignore them. From there it is a simple matter to determine where the income, United have many revenue streams not just shirt sale. In modern day football all clubs have to make a profit it is how they buy the player that lead to success on the pitch. If you can be bothered check this out
Net Spend
http://www.skysports.com/football/news/ ... fer-window
Or this
http://www.transferleague.co.uk/premier ... e-seasons\

The only stats that matter to the club is how many Zlatan shirts have we sold which the answer is "loads"

So you be happy with Zlatan,the club megastore is happy with Zlatan.
coach Marcus managed to get a pop at me and somebody who has been in the desert sun for too long gets a pop at me and sounds happy

As for me i am happy as well

To add to your limited knowledge of America and specifically Arizona, it is snowing as I write this resonse. There are many eco-systems in Arizona.

WELL I DON'T KNOW WHY IT IS SNOWING
GLOBAL WARMING IS A LIE.THE DONALD TOLD YOU SO.HE MUST HAVE STATS(THERE'S THAT WORD AGAIN) TO CONFIRM IT SO ARE YOU SURE IT IS SNOWING OR HAVE YOU BEEN ON THE BUD AGAIN?

More of your techniques that you pull out when you do not know or understand an issue – deflection and insinuate that someone is drunk or stoned. You will not be bothered looking this up either but ….
Prescott, AZ
https://weather.com/weather/today/l/86305
I can't believe it. I can't believe it. Football. Bloody hell.

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Fri Jan 20, 2017 5:32 pm

i won't list answer in bright green.I will just answer your points

Yes a lot do love stats but the game did well enough without stats for 100 years
They are interesting but i hope you agree that the only stat that matters is the final score
Moyes and Sam Allardyce are big stats fans but they aren't helping either of them much at the moment
Matt,Jimmy Murphy and SAF all used their eyes and experience and that is good enough for me
To listen to Gary Neville and Jamie Carragher explaining,through stats,what we have already seen is a waste of time
The only person who placed faith in that was LVG and he wasn't rated in the end by this forum

You seem a bit confused when you agree Rashford and Martial need minutes but not at the Zlatan's expense
What suggestion do you have as clearly one is needed

Just for clarification i gave up paying for my tickets several years ago
I had a business acquaintance who wanted to take them up so i allowed him to do so,rather than just returning them
He pays me and i pay United but the tickets remain in my name
That gets me,in theory,in the priority pots as,in theory,i have had these tickets for 40 years
I am just unlucky in most ballots as opposed to anybody with a large wad of cash,to give the club who is lucky in every ballot
I hope that clarifies

I was laso around in the sixties
I think you'll find that you might struggle to get a ticket at Turf Moor these days but i may be wrong
I know all about the Barrow Boys
I grew up with the Quality Street Gang and Jimmy Swords and Des O'Connor(RIP) and all the boys who run Ardwick and Wythenshawe
They all now struggle as far as i am aware
So i have no problem stepping on my dick as you put it
These are all old farts now,me included

I do not hate overseas people/fans
I resent what they represent and the priority they get over old fans
I suspect if you returned now and explained you went to watch them in the 1960's but work and the Navy took you away but you'd like to see a game you would get the same shit i get about limited availability etc but for £499 etc etc
I think your cousin would be required if you know what i mean

You clearly believe that the Glazers are good for this club
That is your choice
There is no need to show me to accounts as i don't understand them as much as you
I am only a qualified accountant so let's be carefull about treading on dicks
You really do seem to believe all that Sky Sports tell you
You should know better
All about Fake News.You are fed that all day in the USA

As for it snowing in Arizona
Of course i believe you
Why wouldn't i?


Let's start again eh with a smile hopefully

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Sat Jan 21, 2017 11:34 pm

:) my viewpoint on the issues you raised.
Statistics
One of the best examples I have seen recently was the Everton vs City game; City totally dominated the statistics in every category except the final score. Everton had four shots on goal and scored each time, I had a real chuckle at that one. An average manage can use statistics to get one over on another manager, like the way Big Sam handles Wenger teams but IMO a great manager needs to have a feel for the game and be able adjust on the fly to what’s happening on the pitch. The only statistic I give any value to is the teams position at the end of the season.

The Young ums
It is a quandary getting Rashford and Martial minutes and still being competitive in the league. Playing them as wide forwards will give them game experience even if is not in their best suited position and when Zlatan leaves we will have players ready to take over the striker position. I also think that Zlatan doesn’t need to be starting every game; the league must be our priority but in cup games let them get a run out.

Tickets
On a business trip I was schedule to be in London over the weekend. On short notice I called the United USA supports group to try and get tickets for Old Trafford. They had no problem finding me two tickets for $3900 each, I thought he was just fornicate with me but he was serious as a heart attack.

Old Farts
I was born in 51 so I feel your pain, none of my joints work like they used to and probably will not be getting better any time soon :) . Last time Burnley where in the premier league, before they were relegated and bounce back, I got ticket for the game at Turf Moor but got cross threaded on with my cousin. I was at the Wigan station he was in Warrington.

Overseas Fans
I don’t think oversea fans get any special priority it’s just that they are willing to pay the over-the-top price for a ticket. After spending thousand on a plane ticket, transportation, hotels and tickets wouldn’t you be willing to pay stupid money to see the game? Like it or not seats at Old Trafford have become a commodity and like with any commodity the seller will charge whatever the market will pay. It’s a pity that there is no “grandfather” like rules in the UK. As for creative way of getting to a game; I once attended the LFC game at Old Trafford as part of the Norway LFC supporters club, you gotta do what you gotta do.

The Glazers
I don’t believe that the Glazers are good owner or are good for the club orfootball; I do believe that they are better than some who would treat United as nothing more than their next corporate jet. At least the Glazers have finally realized that investment in the club (players = assets) will get them results on the pitch which will in turn increases their profit. I really doesn’t matter to me that they aren’t United fans, I don’t care if they ever show up at Old Trafford or if every player must go through a financial justification; as long as they back the managers requests for the players he wants I am ok with that. If you want to ignore financial reports and instead go with your gut or your nose then so be it, however it make a posts an opinion and not a statement of fact.

Many people that know me say I am the most cynical and skeptical SOB they have ever met and for the most part they are right. I do not take information as verbatim. Just because it’s been published – digital or analog – doesn’t make it correct; but when you see the same information in multiple outlet it’s worth taking note of
I can't believe it. I can't believe it. Football. Bloody hell.

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Sun Jan 22, 2017 5:25 pm

:) my viewpoint on the issues you raised.
Statistics
One of the best examples I have seen recently was the Everton vs City game; City totally dominated the statistics in every category except the final score. Everton had four shots on goal and scored each time, I had a real chuckle at that one. An average manage can use statistics to get one over on another manager, like the way Big Sam handles Wenger teams but IMO a great manager needs to have a feel for the game and be able adjust on the fly to what’s happening on the pitch. The only statistic I give any value to is the teams position at the end of the season.

I BELIEVE WE ARE NOW IN TOTAL AGREEMENT ON STATS
I THINK THE WORDS I AM LOOKING FOR ARE TOTAL BOLLOCKS
SOME OF THE YOUNG UNS ON HERE LIVE BY THE SHIT THEY ARE FED ON COMPUTERS WITH NO FEELING AT ALL FOR ANY GAMES NO MATTER WHAT THE SPORT IS
MATT BUSBY,DON REVIE,BILL SHNAKLY AND JOCK STEIN DID OK WITHOUT ANY STATS
I THINK A FEW ON HERE THAT DON'T REALISE THAT FOOTBALL WAS PLAYED BEFORE SKY WILL HAVE TO GOOGLE THOSE NAMES
TO FURTHER PROVE MY POINT LOOK AT THE THREAD I STARTED ON STATS TODAY
LIVERPOOL 2 SWANSEA 3
STOKE 1 UNITED 1
BERTIES 2 SPURS 2

The Young ums
It is a quandary getting Rashford and Martial minutes and still being competitive in the league. Playing them as wide forwards will give them game experience even if is not in their best suited position and when Zlatan leaves we will have players ready to take over the striker position. I also think that Zlatan doesn’t need to be starting every game; the league must be our priority but in cup games let them get a run out.

WE ARE ALMOST IN AGREEMENT BUT I AM TOLD MARTIAL IS SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING HIS FUTURE WHICH IS WHY HE WAS LEFT AT HOME YESTERDAY
HE IS ON A RELATIVELY SHIT CONTRACT,EXACTLY THE SAME ONE AS HE SIGNED AS UNITED DON'T INCREASE THEM.ALSO HE IS HARDLY PLAYING AND WHEN HE DOES IT IS OUT OF POSITION
FOLLOWING FALCAO AD ZLATAN HE CAN SEE ANOTHER POSSIBLE COMMERCIAL CENTRE FORWARD BUY.HE IS NOT EVEN BEING GIVEN THE CHANCE TO PLAY ALONGSIDE ZLATAN.JUST STUCK ON THE WING
I DON'T THINK WOODWARD WILL PASS UP A,SAY £55M BID AND GET ANOTHER FREE IF THEY HAVE IDENTIFIED AN OLD HERO
I THINK THEY WOULD BE HAPPY TO GET RONALDO IN A COUPLE OF YEARS FOR SAY £1/2m A WEEK

Tickets
On a business trip I was schedule to be in London over the weekend. On short notice I called the United USA supports group to try and get tickets for Old Trafford. They had no problem finding me two tickets for $3900 each, I thought he was just fornicate with me but he was serious as a heart attack.

VERY INTERESTING
WHICH SUPPORTERS CLUB?
I KNOW PETE WHO RUNS THE CLUB FROM NEW YORK(OR AT LEAST HE USED TO,NOT SURE NOW)
HE USED TO RUN THE CLUB FROM NEVADA SMITH'S BAR IN NEW YORK BUT THEN MOVED TO ENDA KEENANS LEGENDS AND JACK DEMPSEYS,NEAR THE EMPIRE STATE
HE IS A TOTALLY STRAIGHT LONG TIME UNITED FAN
I THINK I HEARD SOMETHING ABOUT UNITED HIJACKING THE OPERATION AND TELLING HIM IF HE DIDN'T DO IT THE CLUB WAY THEN THEY WOULD BE UNLUCKY IN EVERY BALLOT
IF THERE WAY IS ALMOST $4000 SOMEBODY NEEDS TO TELL DONALD TRUMP
I HaVE BEEN IN AMERICA ON A FEW HOLIDAYS/PRE SEASON TOURS AND UNITED HAVE TRIED TO STICK ONE UP ME,SEVERAL TIMES,FOR usd1000. NEEDLESS TO SAY THEY DIDN'T GET ANYTHING

Old Farts
I was born in 51 so I feel your pain, none of my joints work like they used to and probably will not be getting better any time soon :) . Last time Burnley where in the premier league, before they were relegated and bounce back, I got ticket for the game at Turf Moor but got cross threaded on with my cousin. I was at the Wigan station he was in Warrington.

WIGAN OR WARRINGTON WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE?
THEY BOTH BEGIN WITHA W !!!

Overseas Fans
I don’t think oversea fans get any special priority it’s just that they are willing to pay the over-the-top price for a ticket. After spending thousand on a plane ticket, transportation, hotels and tickets wouldn’t you be willing to pay stupid money to see the game? Like it or not seats at Old Trafford have become a commodity and like with any commodity the seller will charge whatever the market will pay. It’s a pity that there is no “grandfather” like rules in the UK. As for creative way of getting to a game; I once attended the LFC game at Old Trafford as part of the Norway LFC supporters club, you gotta do what you gotta do.

YOU BELIEVE YOU ARE CORRECT WITH WHAT YOU SAY BUT AS A FAN WHO ATTENDS EVERY GAME I CAN TELL YOU THE HOME GAME SELLS OUT ARE A LIE
UNITED PULL A LARGE NUMBER OF TICKETS AT THE START OF THE SEASON.i MEAN A LARGE LARGE NUMBERTHEN THEY DECLARE EVERY GAME A SELL OUT WITH LIMITED AVAILABILITY ONLY FOR THE £500 DEFROSTED BURGER AND CHIPS
THEY STICK TO THAT STORY RIGHT UP TO THE KICK OFF AND WOULD RATHER LEAVE SEATS EMPTY THAN ADMIT THEY CAN'T FIND ENOUGH MUGS
THE NUMBER OF EMPTIES IN ACTUALLY NOTICEABLY INCREASING
UNITED ARE CURRENTLY GETTING ROUND THIS IN TWO WAYS
10 MINUTES BEFORE THE KICK OFF THEY TELL THE QUEUE,USUALLY JAPANESE THEY HAVE SOME VERY LATE RETURNS AT £55 A POP(THESE ARE NORMALL £42!). BUT YOU HAVE TO BE A MEMBER AND THAT IS ANOTHER £32
SO THEY GET £87 FOR A TICKET
THIS SERVES 2 FOLD.iT IS A NICE LATE EARNER AND TEACHES THE JAPANESE TO PAY UP THE £499 TO BE SURE.THE JAPANESE GOT CUTE WHEN KAGAWA WAS PLAYING AND STOPPED BUYING IN ADVANCE AND BUYING CHEAP ON THE DAY FROM SEASON TICKET HOLDERS WHO COULDN'T USE ALL HIS TICKETS
UNITED SENT PLAIN CLOTHES OUT AND CONFISCATED ANY TICKETS THEY COULD FIND DUE TO "TERMS AND CONDITIONS"WHAT ARSEHOLES!!

The Glazers
I don’t believe that the Glazers are good owner or are good for the club orfootball; I do believe that they are better than some who would treat United as nothing more than their next corporate jet. At least the Glazers have finally realized that investment in the club (players = assets) will get them results on the pitch which will in turn increases their profit. I really doesn’t matter to me that they aren’t United fans, I don’t care if they ever show up at Old Trafford or if every player must go through a financial justification; as long as they back the managers requests for the players he wants I am ok with that. If you want to ignore financial reports and instead go with your gut or your nose then so be it, however it make a posts an opinion and not a statement of fact.

I THINK THE GLAZERS ARE VERY VERY CLEVER COMMERCIALLY BUT AN ABSOLUTE DISGRACE FOR THE GOOD OF ANY FOOTBALL
I THINK THEY KNOW LESS ABOUT THE SPORT THAN MARCUS
BUT AS YOU WERE IN THE 1960'S YOU WILL KNOW WHY A SMALL CLUB LIKE BURNLEY DID SO WELL(BOB LORD) AND ASTON VILLA WON THE EUROPEAN CUP(THE DEADLY DOOG) AND LIVERPOOL BECAME SUCH A FORCE(JOHN SMITH AND JOHN MOORES)
THERE ARE MANY MORE EXAMPLES BUT ONCE YOU GET ARSEHOLES JUST BLEEDING THE CLUB AS DRY AS THEY CAN FOR AS LONG AS THEY CAN IT USUALLY ENDS UP IN TEARS

Many people that know me say I am the most cynical and skeptical SOB they have ever met and for the most part they are right. I do not take information as verbatim. Just because it’s been published – digital or analog – doesn’t make it correct; but when you see the same information in multiple outlet it’s worth taking note of
NO I THINK I AM MORE CYNICAL.I JUST CALL IT BEING A REALIST

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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Mon Jan 23, 2017 1:02 pm

I'm more than happy with Zlatan this season. He's scored in over half the games he's played in. Only Costa and Sanchez have scored more. He matched our best League scorer from last year in December. He has in fact matched the highest total of goals scored in any post Fergie season - and it's still perfectly possible he'll beat van Persie.

It's everyone else who needs to chip in more.
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Re: Zlatan Ibrahimovic

Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:45 pm

I'm more than happy with Zlatan this season. He's scored in over half the games he's played in. Only Costa and Sanchez have scored more. He matched our best League scorer from last year in December. He has in fact matched the highest total of goals scored in any post Fergie season - and it's still perfectly possible he'll beat van Persie.

It's everyone else who needs to chip in more.
Nobody else is getting a chance
He plays up front by himself
When they don't play him and let the kids with pace loose we do better imo
We even do better when we throw Fellaini on to help him jump

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