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Martin
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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 8:21 pm

I'm not sure what point Ivan is trying to make tbh.


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ivandaman
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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 10:08 pm

Martin wrote:I'm not sure what point Ivan is trying to make tbh.


I'll elaborate further on that later because I'm busy at work atm.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 10:39 pm

Carrick 5 Gerrard 0 wrote:
Martin wrote:
Carrick 5 Gerrard 0 wrote:Are you also gonna ban Muslim Americans born in the country, what about those sacrificing their lives day in, day out for their country in the army?
He has already addressed this. U.S. citizens will not be banned or refused entry should they leave the States and attempt to return, whether they are Muslim or not.

Nobody is getting banned anyway.
This is for Ivan, he brought an example of an born US guy but these policies won't address that so what does Ivan want, all Muslims banned?
I agree it won't happen but crazier things have happened
Find me a Muslim country in the middle east or north Africa where the people there have a generally favourable view of the US. Even the ones that immigrate there, for the most part, are doing it for the advantages of living in the US, not because they want to integrate and adapt to an American lifestyle. If you are a true believer in Islam then the American lifestyle is everything you don't believe in, the pursuit of the dollar, material possessions, extravagant lifestyle, etc. Not to say this is how the majority of Americans live, but its what they strive for.

To a certain extent I think immigration can be a good thing. Canada needs immigrants because Canadians aren't reproducing enough to sustain and grow our economy and country. However the US has a rather large population, and a number of people who are out of work, the true unemployment rate is between 20-30%. They really don't need more people immigrating, they would be better off investing in the education system and social programs to prepare their existing population for a more productive lifestyle. As I said earlier, immigration is a tool to improve a country. Allowing more people into a country that can't deal with its current population is not helping them. So the US, IMO, can be more selective as to who they let in. And if you are going to pick and choose who will improve the country you going to do it from Countries who's beliefs, values and lifestyles line up. Quite frankly, for the most part, this doesn't include many muslim countries. Added to that, as I said a lot of Muslim countries don't really like the US, there is plenty of examples world wide of things some (and I strongly stress some) muslims have done to damage the US. In this current climate I think its well within the rights of the US to say, hey, we really don't need anyone, so we are going to suspend accepting people from areas of the world where there is a higher probability of accepting people who's intentions are bad.

And at the end of the day, if the US doesn't want muslims, and this position has garnered a lot of support, support I would suggest is even higher then public opinion and polls suggest because a lot of people would probably hesitate to voice it for fear of backlash, then why would Muslims even want to go there?


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marcus leong
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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 10:41 pm

Relly, Ivan what do you think about Bernie Sanders?


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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 10:53 pm

marcus leong wrote:Relly, Ivan what do you think about Bernie Sanders?
Pretty much everything I disagree with in politics. I do like him as a speaker and a person though.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 11:15 pm

marcus leong wrote:Relly, Ivan what do you think about Bernie Sanders?
I'm not either of them, but I think it's funny that Americans think he's left wing.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 11:26 pm

Dante wrote:
marcus leong wrote:Relly, Ivan what do you think about Bernie Sanders?
I'm not either of them, but I think it's funny that Americans think he's left wing.
LOL - by American standards of course he is about as "left-wing" as you get. He would be slightly left of centre in the UK/Europe etc


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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 11:40 pm

He'd be right of centre over here. Would fit in quite well with New Labour.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 11:42 pm

Possibly. He would certainly be seen as having "moderate views",

Can you even imagine what American (and Fox News in particular) would make of Corbyn! :laugh:


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Re: US Politics Thread

Tue Jan 26, 2016 11:52 pm

I don't actually think they would be able to process it.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:04 am

I think its safe to say that I would not fit in in the UK.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:12 am

RedSte wrote:Possibly. He would certainly be seen as having "moderate views",

Can you even imagine what American (and Fox News in particular) would make of Corbyn! :laugh:
About the same, in reverse, that England thinks of Trump.

Relly - Where do you get your information, you are taking hints from your political messiah - Trump. Say anything regardless of its validity and when questioned either deny or go on another tacked.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:17 am

ArizonaRed wrote:
RedSte wrote:Possibly. He would certainly be seen as having "moderate views",

Can you even imagine what American (and Fox News in particular) would make of Corbyn! :laugh:
About the same, in reverse, that England thinks of Trump.

Relly - Where do you get your information, you are taking hints from your political messiah - Trump. Say anything regardless of its validity and when questioned either deny or go on another tacked.
Not sure what part you are referring to. I follow American news, tv and print, and I follow different sources, not just mainstream shit that is owned by the same people who own your politicians.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:04 am

Where are you getting the 20 - 30% unemployment?


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 2:00 am

Its hard to get a solid number, so people's estimations vary quite a bit, this article will give a good starting point.

http://www.cnbc.com/2014/01/10/


The US publishes their unemployment rate, the U3 monthly, however a more accurate number is the U6 which includes “those marginally attached to the labor force,” plus those “employed part time for economic reasons.” This number usually doubles what the published umemployment rate is.

What's not included in either of those numbers are people that are not looking for work, the ones that just gave up. Also not included are people on welfare. Add those two groups in and who knows what the real number is.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 3:14 am

Carrick 5 Gerrard 0 wrote:He is treating a bunch of people differently because of their beliefs. Why should a Muslim not be allowed to enter America because they believe in a certain God. I have no convictions, I don't support Isis, I class myself as a British Muslim and I am just a part of this society as th me next person, I work, I pay my taxes, I do voulenteering work etc but just because I believe in a certain God, the USA will ban me. Muslims make up a good proportion of the world population, you're gonna ban sportsmen? Politicans? Musicians etc or just us regular joes?
I'm glad the UK don't have anyone like that (with that much support)
Quite Amirah, unless youre planning on flying there, acquiring a gun at K-Mart, go on a mass shooting spree, you have no business in America


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 3:16 am

In the end, Donald Trump is that joke that he might be president who you laugh at right at the beginning while always having that really small fear at the back of your mind that this guy might be in charge, and as time goes on, you realise "holy fornicate this guy is actually going to be president"


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:27 am

Relly is a Trump sheep



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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:46 pm

Relly wrote:
Calling someone a racist is a strong and dangerous accusation. Unfortunately people just love to do it, even without having full stories or proof of said accusations. IMO its done because it makes people feel better about themselves and their own, possibly subconscious, feelings. Lets face it, at the end of the day the majority of people, whether they are white, black, asian, etc habour some racists views, its just human instinct, get drawn to what you know, be cautious of what you don't.

I harbour absolutely zero racist views, is this your way of telling us that you do?



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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:52 pm

Relly wrote:I think its safe to say that I would not fit in in the UK.
It's alright, you'd have both the Tories and UKIP.

I'd be quite glad to send them all to you.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 4:52 pm

mikey wrote:
Relly wrote:
Calling someone a racist is a strong and dangerous accusation. Unfortunately people just love to do it, even without having full stories or proof of said accusations. IMO its done because it makes people feel better about themselves and their own, possibly subconscious, feelings. Lets face it, at the end of the day the majority of people, whether they are white, black, asian, etc habour some racists views, its just human instinct, get drawn to what you know, be cautious of what you don't.

I harbour absolutely zero racist views, is this your way of telling us that you do?
Odd that you're the first one to deny it. :roll:


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Relly
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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 4:52 pm

Sandies wrote:
Carrick 5 Gerrard 0 wrote:He is treating a bunch of people differently because of their beliefs. Why should a Muslim not be allowed to enter America because they believe in a certain God. I have no convictions, I don't support Isis, I class myself as a British Muslim and I am just a part of this society as th me next person, I work, I pay my taxes, I do voulenteering work etc but just because I believe in a certain God, the USA will ban me. Muslims make up a good proportion of the world population, you're gonna ban sportsmen? Politicans? Musicians etc or just us regular joes?
I'm glad the UK don't have anyone like that (with that much support)
Quite Amirah, unless youre planning on flying there, acquiring a gun at K-Mart, go on a mass shooting spree, you have no business in America
That's pretty rich considering how proud of a South African you are.


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Relly
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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 4:58 pm

dbecks07 wrote:Relly is a Trump sheep
You're a fornicate idiot. Ever since you spent the entire 12/13 season telling everyone how bad Michael Carrick was while the rest of the world lauded him for having one of his best season, being instrumental in Uniteds success and being one of the best players in the league I have written off everything you have posted on this board as biased, uneducated bullshit posted by what I could only assume is an immature young person. You still haven't shaken that IMO.


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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 6:28 pm

Relly wrote:
mikey wrote:
Relly wrote:
Calling someone a racist is a strong and dangerous accusation. Unfortunately people just love to do it, even without having full stories or proof of said accusations. IMO its done because it makes people feel better about themselves and their own, possibly subconscious, feelings. Lets face it, at the end of the day the majority of people, whether they are white, black, asian, etc habour some racists views, its just human instinct, get drawn to what you know, be cautious of what you don't.

I harbour absolutely zero racist views, is this your way of telling us that you do?
Odd that you're the first one to deny it. :roll:
Maybe nobody else picked up on it? Or maybe it is because, by my way of thinking, that if you have 'some' racist views, then you're a racist, because, in my book, there is no such thing as a little bit of a racist; you're either a racist, or you're not a racist.

I'd also like to pick up on what you said about Muslim countries hating the US. I don't think that's true. Maybe some extremists feel that way, the likes of ISIS and al-Qaeda etc. but i'd like to know what facts you're basing that on?

There was a programme on telly last week called "The Jihadis Next Door" and it was certainly an eye-opener. The biggest eye-opener, for me, was the fact that the only people that were actively challenging these people who are preaching hatred in the streets, and sometimes violently, was their fellow Muslims. You cannot tar all Muslims with the same brush. It is fundamentally wrong, and very small minded, to discriminate against a massive proportion of the worlds population, just because of their religious beliefs.



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ivandaman
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Re: US Politics Thread

Wed Jan 27, 2016 7:12 pm

Miguel, with all due respect, that's a whole lotta crap


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